How does your chat group work and what are the rules?
Chat group etiquette
Here is a friendly message from Straight Shooters. This forum is our office, our store, our place of business. We keep our doors open by being helpful to all airgunners. Please keep the use of offensive language out of your messages. All information to other airgunners is welcome as are questions for Straight Shooters and others to answer.
How to post an original question
To post a question select the Post button from the bottom left side of the screen (not the bottom right). A screen will appear that asks you to fill in the appropriate fields with a Title, Name and Message. The title field is describes the subject of your post. Please use the title field ONLY for the subject of your post. Do not use it as the body of your post. The name field is whatever you wish to be known by. The message field allows you to post any question or comment.
After typing your message press the Submit button. If the Regular button is selected, the system will ask you to Validate or Edit. If you select Edit, you can makes changes to your post. If you select Validate, your question will be added to the main list page.
If you select the Express button your question will be posted without giving you the chance to make any changes.
To answer a post select the Post to which you wish to respond. Click on the Reply button. Add your name to the Name field. Either post you message above or below the existing message. Once your message has been entered, press Submit. at the next screen. Press Validate to Post the message or Edit to change the message.
How to post an original question
To post a question, select the Post button from the bottom left side of the screen (not the bottom right). A screen will appear fill in the appropriate fields with a Title, Name and Message. The title field describes the subject of your post. The name field is whatever you wish to be known by. The message field is just that post any question or comment you have.
After typing your message press the Submit button.
If the Regular button is selected the system will ask you to Validate or Edit. If you select Edit you can change the post . If you select Validate, your question will be added to the main list page.
If you select the Express button, your question will be posted without giving you the chance to change it.
How to answer an existing post
To answer a post select the post you wish to respond. Click
on the Reply button. Add your name to the Name field. Either post
you message above or below the existing message. Once your message
has been entered press Submit. at the next screen press Validate
to Post the message or Edit to change the message.
You recommend the B-Square mounts and risers, Why?
We recommend BSquare adjustable mounts as well as Beeman and BKL drooper mounts with some rifles. We do that because some rifles are known to have barrel droop. In case you're new to that, it means that the rifle will shoot low even with a scope set in the middle of it's adjustment range. Barrel droop does not effect the accuracy or velocity of the gun at all. But most scopes simply don't have enough adjustment to compensate for the lpellet's low point of impact. Consequently the scope runs out of elevation adjustment and the point of impact is still below the bullseye. So, rather than shim the scope/mount (as with firearms) we use adjustable mounts from B-Sqaure or fixed "drooper" mounts from BKL or Beeman. That solves the issue of barrel droop right away. All these mounts are 1 piece and mount on standard 11mm airgun rails. The fixed drooper mounts from Beeman an BKL are easier to use because the droop compensation is built in. However, many people prefer the BSquare 1 or 2 piece adjustable mounts because they offer more flexible droop compensation.
Mounting
& Adjustment instructions.
I’m looking for a quiet gun to target shoot and take the occasional backyard pest. I have the RWS 45 but it seems to noisy. Are the Models 34 or 36 any quieter? How about the R7 or R9?
The RWS Model 45 has the same powerplant as the Model 34 and 36 but with different stocks. The gun is made to shoot at 1000 fps (slightly less in reality when using a medium weight pellet). We did an experiment comparing a Model 34 to a Beeman R9.and R7. The R9 and Model 34 were very similar in terms of the noise level while the R7 is quieter. This was expected because the R7 is only half the power of the other two rifles. The R-7 is quiet and incredibly accurate out to 30-35 yards but isn't usually regarded as a serious hunting rifle. I would not hesitate to shoot crows out to 30 yds. with the R-7. At 25-35 yards hitting a crow would be childs play unless you had a strong wind, but the knockdown power is not quite enough for humane shooting. To get accuracy and knockdown power at 25-45 yards, a gun should be in the 12-14 fpe range. The 34, 45 and R9 all fall into that power range. Those rifles would still be fairly quiet and give you the power you need.
I'm confused about the different types of airguns. Can you explain them to me?
I hope you don't mind if I just keep complex mechanical concepts in plain words. There are chat groups that go on for hours trying to out-do each other with technical jargon etc.. It's good to remember that we're talking about pellet guns here, not guided missiles. So here goes: There are basically three types of airguns (rifles and pistols)
PNEUMATIC GUNS run on compressed air, but the key is how the air gets compressed for use by your gun. Your Crosman's or Benjamin Sheridan's are multi-strokes and the gun is pumped 2-10 times to reach the desired amount of power needed. Benefits? Medium power, reasonable accuracy, light weight and not too big. Downside? If you need to get a quick second shot off at a pest...you'll be pumping the gun again instead of shooting.
Next, there are single stroke pneumatics - These guns are cocked only once and have little recoil . They are known to have extremely good accuracy at short range and are usually used for 10meter match shooting. Downside? Low hunting power because your can't get very high power by cocking a gun only once.
And finally there are pre-charged pneumatics (PCP's) - these rifles are charged from a scuba tank, handpump or carbon fiber tank to 3000 psi. Upside? Great power, extreme accuracy, no recoil, little effort to cock. Some models even have adjustable power with multiple power settings.
Downside? A customer has to buy the equipment needed to charge the rifles which adds some cost on the front end. And you have to recharge the rifle after approximately 30 shots. Some guns get more shots, some get less. It all depends on the power level of the rifle and the distance you are shooting.
SPRING GUNS - A spring gun uses a metal spring as it's power source. A variation on the spring is the gas ram which works in a similar fasion but uses an enclosed cylinder of charged air. When the gun is cocked, the cocking action compresses the charged air even more and that charged air provides the power. But it is different than a PCP in that the air always remains within the enclosed, sealed unit so it can be cocked over and over again just like a spring gun. They will maintain their pressure for years of shooting.
The spring gun or gas ram gun is cocked by various methods, the most common being the break barrel method. The shooter grabs the barrel and pulls it down. It breaks at the breech. As the barrel is pulled in a downward motion, the piston is pushed back compressing the spring. When the barrel is pushed back up to its normal closed position, the spring is "cocked" under tension. When the trigger is pulled, releasing the spring, the spring and piston head push a column of air which "blows" the pellet out of the barrel. The cocking method varies from breaking the barrel to side-cocking levers or levers under the barrel (underlevers) that are pulled to accomplish the cocking effort. All use the spring and piston to push a column of air.
Upside? Springs and gas rams last for a long time, are easy to use and maintain and range from light to high power. They produce recoil similar to firearms because of the spring motion.
Downside? Eventually you will have to replace the spring, but it is not expensive and the Beeman and RWS can do it for you for a pretty minimal cost. But it is important to be careful not to dry fire a spring gun (pull the trigger on a cocked gun with no pellet loaded). The piston and spring encounter no resistance because there is no pellet filling the barrel, forming a seal. With no resistance, there is a tendency for the piston to slam into the front wall of the compression tube which could damage the piston and/or seal. It is not expensive to replace but it is a pain in the neck to send the gun off to the warranty center for a couple of weeks.
Spring guns are far and away the most commonly used in the adult airgun world.
CO2 AIRGUNS - These guns use CO2 as the power source.
Upside? No recoil-easy to use, little cocking effort and can be extremely accurate. Downside? CO2 is affected by air temperature changes. If you sight in your gun outside on a warm day, and the next day is cooler, your point of impact will be affected. Even temperature changes from early morning to noon can cause point of impact problems which could require re-sighting. CO2 guns are at their best in a temperature controlled indoor shooting environment. If you wish to use a CO2 powered gun outside, it is a good idea to leave the gun outdoors for a couple of hours to let it acclimate to the outdoor temperature. Doing so will yield better results.
I am interested in a pellet pistol. I am particularly interested in a RWS 5G. Possibly a Beeman P1. Any feed back would be helpful. I may be interested in scoping in future.
The guns referred to are both single stroke spring piston pistols. RWS features the 5G Magnum while Beeman features the P1. Both are excellent pistols with very good accuracy and a lot of power for a pistol. The RWS 5G Magnum does not allow for mounting a scope or red dot but the Beeman P1 does.
How can I get my spring air gun to shoot as well as it should from the bench.".I have owned an RWS 36 and now an Anshutz 335. Both seemed to shoot about 1/2" at 10 meters and about 1" at 25 yards, for 5 shot groups. I have used Bushnell 6 X 18 and Simmons Air gun scopes in RWS airgun mounts. I have tried many many different pellets. I would like to hear if these are typical spring gun results. I can't seem to get the 0.10 to 0.16 ctc that are advertised with the guns. I try to rest the front forearm on a very soft front rest and to hold the gun loosely as advised to allow the gun to free recoil. Do I need better technique, or perhaps a better airrifle. I would really like to cut these groups in half.
My guess is that you just need to practice, practice and practice somemore. And it helps to be realistic also. Factory ratings are not usually achieved in the real world by real shooters. The R-7, for instance, is rated at .10" and I'm sure the gun can do it. But I can't shoot that well on my best day and I'm an average shooter. Even on a bench, my best is about .15-.20. I think I hold the gun slightly different from shot to shot and my trigger pull is undisciplined to put it kindly. I sit a little different each time. All these tiny little things fall under the heading of "faulty technique". And while that might be true, I suspect most shooters have a few bad habits of their own. And don't forget recoil and spring movement because they play a large part as well. Sounds to me like you're a real normal airgunner.
My guess is that the Model 36 isn't supposed to be any better than .15-.20" anyway at the best of times. But be sure to try some round headed pellets because they usually yield the tighest groups.
I'm thinking of upgrading my current RWS 36 .177 up to a Beeman RX-2 either in .20 or .22 caliber. The gun would be used on a farm for pest control at 30 to 50 yards as well as for some plinking. I would like any thoughts, recommendations and experiences with the RX-2 as well as how it compares to the RWS 48 and 52 models. Also, since the RX-2 .177 is a high velocity rifle, wouldn't it be better to go with a heavier .177 pellet than to go .20 and use lighter pellets to keep the velocities up. I would think even a heavy .177 pellet would have high velocites and would be the same weight or heavier than a light .20 pellet. Any thoughts on that as well would be appreciated.
Craig and I can tell you volumes on the RX-2 because the RX-1 (same gun, different stock) was our first super-magnum rifle and remains our favorite gun for hunting. Our rifles are in .20 caliber and they pack a wallop. We too were concerned about keeping the velocity as high as possible, but were also concerned with knock-down power (kinetic energy). What we found was that the velocity was not nearly as important as we thought it was and in fact, we turned the power down from a muzzle energy of 21 ft lbs to 19 ft lbs. We actually lowered our velocity from the 900's down to 775-800 ft per second. Our accuracy went WAY up and the knock-down power with 14.3 grain Crosmans was more than adequate for crows, squirrels, gophers or rats. We have never bothered to turn the power back up. For those not familiar with the current RX-2, it uses a gas ram instead of a spring. A pump and gauge can be purchased separately which allows a person to decrease the power from optimum and pump it back up to full power as needed.
We found that accuracy suffered at full power and the gun really sweetened at the 19 ft lb range. However, with the current RX-2, turning down the power isn't necessary. The laminate stock of the RX-2 is denser than the RX-1's beech stock and it really makes a difference at full power. The RX-2 at full power shoots as smoothly as our RX-1's do with the power turned down. But be aware that if you decide to buy any super-magnum gun in .177, you should use the heaviest .177 pellets for best accuracy and performance. All the super-magnum rifles will require the heaviest pellets in .177 caliber for the best results.
We have a RWS 52 in .22 it's smooth, powerful and accurate. Great hunting gun. The RX-2 in .20 caliber is an awesome gun. Kinetic energy (knock-down power at the target) is based on a combination of muzzle energy, the ballistic coefficient of the pellet used and the distance to the target.
We used to want every gun to shoot at 900-1000 ft per second. We have since learned (quite slowly as we're very stubborn) that for spring guns, the best combination of power and accuracy seems to occur in the 775-850 fps range for many magnum guns. We also realize that the catalogs get their velocity figures by using the lightest pellets they can find. But they have little knock-down power and the velocity drains off very fast. Wind also blows the light pellets around more. A heavier pellet or larger caliber has more wind resistance, sustains its velocity longer and in many cases, yields a flatter trajectory. We try to make our magnum guns end up in the 775-850 range when using the heavier pellets. We have really had to change our thinking on that issue.
What is select barrel angle or select condition stock?
Beeman guns can be ordered (in MOST cases) with 2 options. Straight Shooters does not charge for these options, some dealers do.
The options are:
1. Select barrel angle- means that that particular gun is considered to have minimal barrel droop. We have found that to be the case in reality also. It means in most cases, being able to get by with just using the adjustment clicks on your scope, and not having to buy adjustable mounts as well. RWS does not offer the option and their guns are known to have barrel droop, which is why their C-Mount is an adjustable mount. But keep in mind, barrel droop is not a problem as long as you use a good, adjustable mount. Barrel droop is more of a scope issue than a gun issue. It does not affect accuracy or velocity. The issue with barrel droop is that most scopes don't have enough clicks of adjustment to compensate for the barrel droop. And adjustable mount solves that issue easily and quickly. The adjustable mount is used to make all the rough corrections and the scope adjustment knobs are used to fine-tune any small remaining adjustment. And I should mention, all guns have barrel droop to a certain degree. RWS rifles are not the only guns with barrel droop. It is a good thing to know that some Beeman dealers do not order their stock with the options and those guns typically have some barrel droop. An adjustable mount really helps that situation.
2. Select condition stock - simply means that the stock has no flaws and in many cases, has a little prettier wood grain pattern.
What would you vote for R9 or RWS 46?
RWS Model 46 or R-9? Having both guns, I'd have to say that I would not compare the two in terms of useage. The R-9 has been designed as a moderately priced, medium powered air rifle. It is known to have good accuracy and plenty of power. This is a truly, decent gun.
The RWS 46 on the other hand, is probably one of the least powerful of the RWS line of air rifles. But it is a very accurate rifle. It yields about 12 fpe (ft.lbs.) at the muzzle and is quieter with a smoother shooting action due the lower power level. It really is a sweet gun.
Which would I vote for? Well, if I were just doing general plinking rather than hunting, I would choose the RWS Model 46. If I were doing pest control or hunting on any kind of regular basis, I would go for the extra power of the R9. But I can honestly say that I would be happy with either gun. The only problem is figuring out how to afford two excellent guns rather than one.
I see you think highly of the R7 but would the RWS 36 be a good shooter? I want accuracy, light recoil and easy to cock. Are higher velocity guns less accurate?
We have a good bit of experience with both guns. As we've said before, the R7 is the easiest cocking, most accurate, quietest spring rifle and has the least recoil of the two guns mentioned. It also has the least power.
The Model 34,/36 are the same guns with different stocks. You pay a little more for the Model 36 because of the nicer stock and finish, but the gun is the same as the Model 34. While the 34/36 rifles are more powerful, they aren't quite as accurate as the R7. The R7 cocks very easily, has very moderate recoil and is much smoother than the 34/36.
If I had to pay the price of a Model 36 or R7, I would also consider the Beeman R-9. Same price range, plenty of power, good accuracy and excellent fit and finish. It amkes yet another good choice. Would I be happy with any of them? Absolutely. They're all nice. It always comes down to thinking hard about the intended purpose for your airgun. Will it be for hunting? Do you need more power? Will you be doing general plinking? It's important to decide what the purpose of the gun will be.
But accuracy is always the most important factor regardless of the intended use. Are powerful guns less accurate? - Not necessarily. But more recoil makes it more difficult to become proficient with your gun It takes more practice and holding your gun properly becomes more critical. Allowing the gun to have its normal movement becomes more important. Little or no recoil also makes a gun easier to shoot .All spring guns will require a learning curve. The higher the power, the longer the learning curve to become truly proficient. But it is definitely fun learning.